Forum:Re-theme for Island Paradise

I wanted to get this discussion going early enough in advance, so I'm starting it now.

As you may recall, when Supernatural was released last year, the wiki temporarily changed to a relevant theme. This re-theme included modifying the wiki wordmark (see File:WikiLogoSupernatural.png), the colors of the Wikia topnav bar and bottom bar, and the wiki background image. We didn't do a redesign for University Life, but since we still have a couple months before the release of IP, the time seems right to start planning a related theme, assuming everyone wants to do this.

Additionally, I've seen some comments from people on the IRC that the wiki's background could stand to be changed. While I don't care one way or the other about it, we could possibly use the IP-themed background as a longer-term background for the wiki, from before the expansion's release, and for a few months afterwards. Otherwise, the background could revert to our standard design when the re-theme period ends.

So, do you have any thoughts or ideas? --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 00:35, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

Discussion
I think that this is a great idea. We could add replace the Plumbbob in the wordmark with the palm tree from the positive Loner moodlet and get the wiki a bit more blue and orange-reddish (like the Island Paradise logo) and change the background to a Sunlit Tides panorama or try to find images of the expansion pack's world. 20:03, April 25, 2013 (UTC)


 * I agree with the above. Plus, this wiki's theme could use a refreshment. I think that either Island Paradise or the Time Travel pack (when officially announced) could be used to enhance it.  Cavia (  wheek  •   speak  ) 20:21, April 25, 2013 (UTC)

Island Paradise would be good for a summer theme. Plus a fresh coat of paint wouldn't hurt so I'm all for the change. I reckon something scenery-based would look nice. 20:23, April 25, 2013 (UTC)


 * I really like this idea. 06:55, April 26, 2013 (UTC)

rightI thought the change of the theme was for Halloween theme, but I forgot when it was re-themed actually. I think it would be nice to have some little visual change with the design. IP logo also use 2 shades, orange and light blue, so it can really suit since the majority of the wiki's color is dark blue and green. I think this sunbathing icon looks good for the logo.  Nikel  Talk  –  Vote!  12:21, April 26, 2013 (UTC)

There's something we should keep in mind regarding the logo. Since we don't ourselves design the logo (usually Erry does it), we need to be able to accommodate his needs. So the design for the icon in the center of the logo should be simple enough for him to add without difficulty. I think that this would be accomplished by using a sun in place of the plumbbob, or in leaving the plumbbob in place but changing the word colors. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 15:30, April 30, 2013 (UTC)

Or, you know, we could change the theme to celebrate my birthday the day after IP's NA release. ;) Just kidding! Though, I do think this is a good idea. I support changing the theme for a longer period of time, as the EP is being released in the summer and is (basically) summer-themed. As for the logo, I like DanPin's colour suggestion and LiR's suggestion for the sun to replace the PlumbBob (if possible). -- Bleeh (talk) (blog) 22:42, April 30, 2013 (UTC)

Moving ahead
Seeing as we have 1 month to do this, we may as well try to get a move on. I've made a provisional background that we could possibly use for the reskin. Installation instructions are as follows:
 * Click here to install the background to your personal CSS.

I drew inspiration from a UL reskin as well as the photograph-like presentation of the skin used by the Half-Life Wiki. Basically I wanted to show scenery with some of the features of the expansion.

My main concern with this skin is readability and with the "photographs" taking up a lot of screen space, particularly on monitors with a resolution lower than 1920x1080 (I'm using 1366x768); I do have an earlier version of the file I used to build the background in case I need it. I haven't thought on colour scheme we should move the wiki to just yet though I think DanPin's idea of blue and orange would work nice. The logo appears to be the most complicated part as we don't handle that ourselves and it's not easy to get ahold of the user who does make it.

So feel free to comment on my proposed background (even if you despise it) and anything else. 11:52, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * I despise it No... It looks very good, honestly. However, a minor thing... we're going to need to increase the opacity of the content space, so that the content is easier to see in front of the sailboat. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 12:16, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * That crossed my mind. Fortunately it can easily be done. 17:00, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * The photographs should be shrunk in size and (as LiR said) the sailboat should be easier to see. Otherwise, great job on the background Lab! Ѧüя◎ґ (talk) 17:05, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Also, in order to keep us from bugging Erry everytime something like this happens, one of us should probably ask him for the files he used to make the logo (for example, a .psd file) or something like that. 17:10, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * I've uploaded a version which shrinks the photographs and it should take the place of the original file once Wikia's servers catch up. Better or worse? 17:21, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Postscript: Having seen the newer version in action, the photographs are out of the way of the main wiki body, only issue now is the sailboat which we can fix easily. 17:26, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Very good! I like it a lot! 18:47, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * I like it. Dharden (talk) 19:16, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Two thumbs up. Of course, the opacity is still something that might need tweaking when we implement the theme. Also, orange yellow and blue for the wiki theme sounds great. I'll pop open the Theme Editor and try out some colors (I won't implement anything) and see what looks good. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 22:18, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * On the topic of handing over the .psd file, I don't have any plans on doing so. I will however still offer my services since I myself am a Sims fan, but until there is a time when I never check the wiki(s) I go to, I create the logo myself. Erry (talk) 22:27, May 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * Just so we're clear, I don't think what DanPin said was intended to mean that we no longer want to use you or your logo. Sometimes there is a discussion about whether we want to alter the logo in some way (for a re-theme or a holiday, for instance) and we're always hesitant to do this because we're worried that we are asking too much of you, especially since we have no way of rewarding the work that you do. If you still wish to create the logos, I don't think any of us will object. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 22:36, May 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * I understood exactly what DanPin said. I'm saying I don't want to give it out until I feel like I won't be able to update it accordingly (i.e. when I stop visiting the sites I visit daily). I didn't take it as you guys not wanting to use the logo anymore. On the topic of hesitancy, you shouldn't be, I do this stuff all the time. And I don't expect a reward besides being credited as having done the logo. Erry (talk) 22:57, May 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * In that case, I would like new logos for - Christmas, Halloween, Easter, April Fool's Day, Veterans/Armistice Day, Valentine's Day, Mother's Day, Administrative Professionals' Day, and the Independence Day of Sierra Leone. Kthanks. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 00:40, May 14, 2013 (UTC)
 * 1. Workable 2. Workable 3. Workable 4. I'll give you an empty .png or a really badly, made-in MSPaint version 5. I don't acknowledge it so I don't do it. 6. Workable, definitely workable actually. 7. There is no definitive Mother icon/image in Sims so I don't think its possible. 8. what in the world. 9. what in the world, the sequel. Erry (talk) 01:15, May 14, 2013 (UTC)

On a different track, when would be a good time to implement the re-theme? Obviously we do it before the TS3:IP release, but how soon before? If we're choosing to make this a long-term change, it might make sense to make the change closer to the beginning of June, and keep it up throughout (Northern Hemisphere) summer, into September or so. We could even start it in later May, if we're ready by then. Thoughts? --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 22:23, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Last week of May/first week of June sounds cool. 22:25, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * How long will the theme stay up after the actual Island Paradise game itself is released? Because I know we kept the Supernatural and UniversityLife backgrounds up for a while after those two games were released. 23:54, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * The Supernatural re-theme was up about a week after release. We never did a re-theme for University Life, though. Personally, I think we should leave it up for a longer period of time. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 23:55, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * I would suggest perhaps until some time in September? The EP is summer-themed (sort of) and having it up until the end of summer seems appropriate. -- Bleeh (talk) (blog) 01:42, May 14, 2013 (UTC)

Let's shift gears, and try to decide what the logo will look like. That way, we can give Erry plenty of time to do the photoshopping. And, it might help us decide how the rest of the theme is going to look. Remember - we're probably going with Lost Labyrinth's background (see above if you haven't gotten a chance yet), so think of ideas that look good along with that background. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 06:44, May 17, 2013 (UTC) right|thumb
 * We could use either sun or sunbathing icon for the logo, and the logo should have light blue & orange borders to match IP logo. LiR, I'm not sure if this is how the background should look like... It looks stretched badly.  Nikel  Talk  –  Vote!  13:55, May 17, 2013 (UTC)
 * It seems to me that the "stretching" is a result of how the image is zoomed in for monitors with a lower resolution than 1080p (blame Wikia). Using a laptop of the same resolution as Nikel's image, I zoomed out to how it probably should look to a 1080p user and it seems fine.right|300px


 * If you're referring to image artifacting, it's down to both EA's below-average sources and possibly the fact I opted for JPEG compression to keep the file size down. I do have a PNG copy that is better quality but the file size is so large that anyone here with a slow connection would have a bad time loading it.


 * In a perfect world, we'd be able to make it so we can deliver a 1080p version, a 720p version and a 240p version to tailor to everyone... 16:17, May 17, 2013 (UTC)

Okay so it's been 1 week since the background was created. Currently we have to decide what we want done with the logo, colour scheme (getting there with that) and the mosaic header if applicable.

If we're going with the yellow/orange and lighter blue colour scheme which LiR suggested then it would make sense to try and get the logo to go in that direction with perhaps DanPin's palm tree idea for the logo, or maybe the sun, I don't know. Apologies if it seems like I'm trying to rush this but it's best to at least try and get somewhere with this so that it's ready before the IP release unlike my Seasons re-skin that became the Christmas reskin. 14:36, May 19, 2013 (UTC)
 * On the subject of colour scheme, I did just write a load of CSS which incorporated a sandy yellow and a lighter blue and I'm honestly not sure how I felt about it. To me it felt like it was missing something. I've dumped everything inside User:Lost Labyrinth/IPskin.css if anybody wants to take a look though admittedly I'd rather do this via Special:ThemeDesigner. It's uhh...less work. 22:07, May 19, 2013 (UTC)
 * So uhh, once you guys have all the color choices ready, this is just waiting to be recolored. Erry (talk) 04:39, May 20, 2013 (UTC)
 * I think it fits pretty well. Great job! :) 16:13, May 20, 2013 (UTC)

thumbHere's the wiki design that I've been using for the past couple days. Erry designed a different background which I put into my .css, and I also chose to take the old wiki background and place it behind the topnav menu (replacing the Mosaic pictures). I'm used to the design/images/colors as I've used it now for a couple days, but what do you think? Note that everything will look *slightly* different once added with Theme Designer. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 05:09, May 24, 2013 (UTC)
 * It looks great, LiR. Maybe the orange can be a little darker, or given more orange-ish tone? I love Erry's logo too. :D  Nikel  Talk  –  Vote!  06:42, May 24, 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep in mind as well that we can tweak the colors or appearance of things after we implement the new theme. This is a flexible thing. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 20:26, May 24, 2013 (UTC)

Given that I made the theme design that we were working around until now, I feel like I'm obliged to say a few things.

Firstly I wish to express my dissatisfaction over how a secondary background has appeared out of nowhere with absolutely no effort made whatsoever to even attempt to discuss which one the community wishes to use. The approach taken on this discussion would probably have been the best option here, but it's too late to even go that route given this ideally needs to be wrapped up within the next week or two. In future, I would strongly appreciate if things like this were discussed directly instead of just forced (being bold can only go so far) as it's little things like this which can make users feel discredited for their work, which is not a little thing at all (and don't bother saying that somebody tried to discuss this with me properly, I've heard it before; it doesn't make up for anything).

Moving onto the background itself, I like it for what it is but I feel that the black plumbbobs are too much "in the way" for it to really stand out. Without sounding arrogant, I'd prefer to use my proposed background as the content space isn't as obscured by the images and we only need to increase the opacity for things to properly fit.

Finally, I didn't post a wall of text with the sole purpose of shooting down background #2. If it's decided that background #2 is used then so be it. I'm not annoyed at the fact that there is a second background proposed but rather I'm displeased at the spirit of which it came out of nowhere and how it was presented to the community.

Cue the same responses we always get in a situation like this. 09:42, May 26, 2013 (UTC)
 * I did not intend for this reaction, I did not even attempt to force the image, I just dropped it on the IRC and made it quickly due to boredom. However one thing I have to add into the discussion is the top header colors, I made this through css, using colors extracted from the Island Paradise logo. Erry (talk) 14:25, May 27, 2013 (UTC)
 * I'll echo what Erry said. I never proposed that we use the background that he designed, and even if I thought we should use it instead of the one designed by Lab, I would've had the courtesy to talk to him one-on-one before pursuing that, since I know he put time and energy into making the background he made. Erry's background is also very good, but as the community has already committed to Lab's background, it would take similar community action to change the decision, which is not something I'm going to pursue because I do believe that Lost Labyrinth's design is good.


 * Now, I'm not going to get into really dissecting what Lab said above because I really don't think this is the time or the place for it. I'll only say that I believe what he wrote might have been an over-reaction. If he had maybe asked for clarification (something like "is it the intent that we use Erry's background instead of the one I made" would have been fine), instead of making the assumption that he was being slighted or discredited, we could've avoided this unpleasantness. Had he asked for some clarification, I could have politely said that I was only using Erry's background as a trial, not necessarily suggesting that we use it instead of his. Instead it was assumed that I was trying to single-handedly change the decision of the community, which was never my intent.


 * All that being said, we've diverted from the topic enough, so there should be no more discussion on the matter. Unless the community really wants to use Erry's background, we're going to stick with the original decision and use Lab's. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 01:33, May 28, 2013 (UTC)
 * If this is the case then I apologise for jumping to conclusions. Maybe in the future it might be best to clarify from the offset for the sake of clarity. 09:29, May 28, 2013 (UTC)
 * After a night's sleep and another read of what I've written, I think much of what I said (or, more accurately, how I said it) was impolite and just as much an over-reaction as I accused you of making. I apologize, and I take back those remarks. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 16:24, May 28, 2013 (UTC)

Wrapping up
Everyone who has commented here seems to be thinking along the same lines for the colors, background (Lost Labyrinth's) and everything else. The only thing we're really waiting for is the logo, then we can roll-out! Would we want to have the orange/yellow and a light blue blend on the logo? what does everyone think? --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 17:23, May 29, 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry, I'm a little distracted and couldn't keep up with current discussions lately. Which one is the latest version of the background and logo, could you point it out? If it's the one in LiR's image, I'd go with it. The light blue color is nice, but for the yellow, I really like Erry's orange in here. The logo just needs to be recolored with the matching theme and IMO it's good to go (after a quick preview though).  Nikel  Talk  –  Vote!  15:31, May 30, 2013 (UTC)
 * The background would be the one that Lost Labyrinth designed, the blue would be the color used in the image I added above, and the orange/yellow would be the one that Erry designed. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 19:11, June 1, 2013 (UTC)
 * Background, left or right?


 * Personally, I prefer the right one, and only if the background isn't oversized like the image I had above. Other than that, I pretty much love it.  Nikel  Talk  –  Vote!  13:49, June 2, 2013 (UTC)

Implementation
Alright, as you may have noticed, I've implemented the brunt of the re-theme changes. We're still waiting on a recolored logo, though personally I think the current logo colors work fine as well. I'm leaving this thread open, mainly to deal with other theme issues as they may occur. --  LostInRiverview talk ~ blog 00:48, June 7, 2013 (UTC)